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rumor: no AC in 2016, 2017 is in Egypt, Rome, or Greece, some details (confirmed by kotaku)

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http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1165890

so yeah i'm not reading most of the details, just read the first post. It seems a bit predictable/fanfictiony, but also kind of makes sense. In any case, if Ubi isn't looking at The Witcher's storytelling and sense of place, they should be.

(hopefully they're not looking at the witcher for combat, specifically)

confirmed by kotaku (folks who leaked Unity and Syndicate): http://kotaku.com/sources-next-big-assassins-creed-set-in-egypt-skippin-...

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Just saw a thread about this on the official AC forums as well. I hope it's true.
I like the idea of AC taking a break for a year and I'm interested in the Ancient Egypt setting as well.

Plus there are rumours that Ubi would use 2016 to release a remastered edition of (some of) the last-gen games. Which would be fine by me.

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Altair Auditore wrote:
Just saw a thread about this on the official AC forums as well. I hope it's true.

pssh.

THB is the Official AC Forum.

The other one is just a fan forum hosted by Ubisoft.

Innocent

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Double McStab with Cheese wrote:
Altair Auditore wrote:
Just saw a thread about this on the official AC forums as well. I hope it's true.

pssh.

THB is the Official AC Forum.

The other one is just a fan forum hosted by Ubisoft.

Innocent

Actually this, though.

In response to the actual thread, I'd be down for AC taking a break for a year. Games are expensive. This will allow me to prioritize something else, financially, that I otherwise wouldn't have gotten to experience. And hopefully, it will mean a higher bar of quality for the next Assassin's Creed game that hits in 2017, which is a great thought to have.

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Double McStab with Cheese wrote:
Altair Auditore wrote:
Just saw a thread about this on the official AC forums as well. I hope it's true.

pssh.

THB is the Official AC Forum.

The other one is just a fan forum hosted by Ubisoft.

Innocent

Hehe you're absolutely right Big smile

I'd edit my post if I could but for some reason my post doesn't have an "Edit" button at the bottom. Has that always been the case?

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kotaku confirmed this. again, I haven't been paying super close attention to the details, but there is the general talk about more fully-formed progresion systems, revamped combat (again... for like the 4th time, right?) and horses being back. And the vague thing of "inspired by open world rpgs like The Witcher, which i can only assume is related to the length and style of storytelling.

Also, it sounds like a years gap between AC games may become the standard going forward. perhaps more, if the new game disappoints.

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I want to Believe...

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reading some of the details, I think what they mean by "like the witcher" is that this and future games seem to be set before Assassins and Templars existed as formal groups. Which means that you'll be a lone assassin who takes jobs from random people, but probably only accepts ones that fit their own personal code (or creed). This is pretty much exactly how Witchers operate, in that series.

It also fits perfectly with a player running around an open world choosing what quests to do when they feel like it, though i'm sure there will be some personal narrative drawing you through to some extent. (like there is in the witcher games)

The ancient egypt (or whatever) setting also gives the opportunity for TWCB to still be around. After all this is the time period where the deities they became known as originated from, right? And the lack of (detailed) surviving recorded history provides plenty of room to show humans worshiping or fearing very real and physical beings that seem otherworldly.

And there's mention of it being a return to the sort of AC1 concept (or perhaps more recently black flag), where you're in a big natural landscape with cities/villages in between, except it's apparently all seamless. (and a colorful/varied landscape, unlike The Kingdom and to a lesser extent black flag's islands) I think this is much more interesting than one huge unwieldy city.

EDIT: to be clear, Kotaku confirmed that these details line up with confirmed sources, but some things obviously might change. Things changed with syndicate and it was leaked only a year before it came out, instead of two years.

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If this turns out to be true, I'm down. This sounds like a direction I'm interested in. Also, as DAZ said, them taking a year off decreases the chance of shipping a rushed, unfinished product and will likely increase the quality of the final product.

The rumors about a remastering of old titles stem from Ubisoft registering the domain "assassinscreedcollection.com" (source here, which could be a collection of remastered games. I think the Ezio games are fine as they are now, but a remastered version of AC1 is something that'll get me really excited. Hey Ubisoft, are you still reading these forums? If so, I've got a little something and something else for you.

Also looking over those threads I noticed something interesting:

DAZ, Dec 2012 wrote:
I would so buy this if it came out.
Assassin's Creed: Re-Synched
(without cheesy name please Tongue )

DAZ, Sep 2014 wrote:
Assassin's Creed Remastered, huh? ;D
Might be fun to slap a nice themed title on it like, Assassin's Creed Re-Synchronized or something crazy like that.
Anyway, title doesn't really matter.


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gerund's pattern recognition will be the end of me >.<

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give me a version of assassins creed 3 that doesnt kind of hurt my eyes because of frametearing or whatever and i'll definitely play that for a long time.

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an interesting thing: all periods of ancient egypt take place before the canonical invention/first use of the hidden blade in the AC universe. I wonder if we might just have an ordinary dagger? That would be kind of cool, imo.

also i didn't mention one of the more interesting features the game is supposed to have: a pet eagle that you can control. I guess this might be a replacement for the brotherhood assistance manuevers and/or hiring factions.

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Jermaine Tito wrote:
an interesting thing: all periods of ancient egypt take place before the canonical invention/first use of the hidden blade in the AC universe. I wonder if we might just have an ordinary dagger? That would be kind of cool, imo.

also i didn't mention one of the more interesting features the game is supposed to have: a pet eagle that you can control. I guess this might be a replacement for the brotherhood assistance manuevers and/or hiring factions.

It'd be really interesting to see an AC game without a hidden blade, given that it's such an iconic weapon. A regular dagger is a perfectly fine replacement for me. I liked using the short blade anyways.

The eagle is something that excites me. If you've seen Alpha footage of Far Cry Primal, it's a mechanic in there as well. Here's a bit of video where the eagle is shown off. It is indeed supposed to replace the assistance you'd normally get from the Brotherhood or factions, as well as give you the opportunity to scout an area from above.


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i hope it's not exactly the same in that respect, as far as seeing through the eyes of the eagle. that's a bit goofy for AC but i'd be fine with just siccing him on guards from my perspective

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Jermaine Tito wrote:
an interesting thing: all periods of ancient egypt take place before the canonical invention/first use of the hidden blade in the AC universe. I wonder if we might just have an ordinary dagger? That would be kind of cool, imo.

Darius used the hidden blade first in 465 BCE.

Cleopatra was the final active Pharaoh of the Ptolemaic Kingdom, which ran from Alexander the Great's death in 323 BCE to her death in 30 BCE.

All that history of Egypt was after Darius's use of the hidden blade. So if the game chooses to focus on the ushering in of the Ptolemaic Kingdom through the killing of Alexander the Great, or the ushering out of it by the killing of Cleopatra, that's still a lot of history AFTER the first canonical hidden blade.

That said, we know that Cleopatra was assassinated by the Assassin Amunet with a poisonous asp. So even if the hidden blade was around it could still be unused by some or in some situations at least.

Couple this with “There are talks about making a trilogy of this same character, so they might explore Greece/Rome next” and I would venture that it's later in the Egyptian dynasties - closer to the Ptolemaic Kingdom (where the hidden blade exists) than the building of the pyramids (2500 BCE).

One more hypothesis. Amunet was alive in the AC universe in 30 BCE, but in egyptian mythology is a goddess not a mortal. This leads me to speculate that she may be very very close to the branching of TWCB and human, or even TWCB all by herself. This leads me to speculate that in the AC universe, the pyramids may have been built by TWCB (their society anyway, the human slaves likely did the work). All this to say that I bet the game takes place AFTER Darius showed the hidden blade in 465 BCE, otherwise there would be much tighter interaction with TWCB in the everyday life of the Assassin because I speculate that they'd still be around. Recall that it was TWCB through the Apple that possessed George Washington to build a pyramid in NYC. Maybe they really like their pyramids.

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Going back to “There are talks about making a trilogy of this same character, so they might explore Greece/Rome next” ...

If it is Cleopatra's era (dead in 30 BCE) that we explore, the Roman Empire is just getting started. Augustus (Octavian) started the Roman Empire in 17 BCE. We know that Octavian fought the Assassins in 42 BCE after the assassination of Caesar by the Assassin Brutus.

I mean, even if we don't play as Amunet or Brutus. And even if we don't kill Cleopatra, Caesar or Augustus... the overlap of these leaders, the oppression in the era, the revolts and conquests, AND the KNOWN assassin/templar stories means that we can certainly play in this era and run into a lot of interesting characters.

That said, they could also choose to go before. But to say that we can't have a hidden blade in any interesting period of ancient Egypt is incorrect.

Again, all speculation. But I would be SHOCKED if they picked a time BEFORE the hidden blade.

-----------

To play the other side of my coin in my previous post though, it's not entirely likely that TWCB really were in charge still in 2500 BCE. Adam and Eve escaped in 75000 BCE and Eve lead the revolt against them, and likely didn't live to be 72500 years old. Then again, do we know anything about the lifespan of TWCB? Maybe a 1:1 hybrid COULD live to be 75000 years old...

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Really interesting speculation. I'm down for any of the above to happen, honestly. Hidden Blade or not, I have a feeling that even if we don't get one at the very beginning of the game, it might become some kind of unlockable hyper-weapon (by pure virtue of how stealthy it'd make your Kills) by the end of the game.

All of the thoughts on the Isu are bone-chilling. I've always been one of those people who've thought, "Man... It's pretty absurd that the pyramids were built by mere human beings controlling other mere human beings... I mean, OBVIOUSLY they were, but what if, y'know?" It's not a theory I can entertain for very long in the real world, but if AC does take the, "Built by ancient entities angle," hell freaking yeah. That's always been one of my favorite things about this franchise. It like to take the things you think about that are like, "Nah, haha, that's a little silly and not creepy at all, r-right guys? G-Guys?!" And present them in such a way that it somberly says, "Actually yes, they're creepy, and yes you're allowed to freak out." [puts hand on the player's shoulder]

I'm mostly looking forward to the mechanical reboot or revamp, to be honest. I've wanted this for a while, I think many of us have. A game that doesn't just rebuild "The AC Core" but rebuilds what "The AC Core" even MEANS, from the ground up, while keeping the potentially EXCELLENT Narrative and Lore intact. Whether I roam with a Dagger or Hidden Blade, as long as I have mechanics with increased fluidity, responsiveness to the player's inputs, and genuine depth of interactions with both the AI and the game world, I will be - for the few weeks that I lunge into AC Egypt - the happiest man alive.

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oh, i actually misread the AC wiki and thought it said the blade was made in the 5th century AD, not BCE.

either way it would make sense to start off without a hidden blade if we're a lone roving lower case "a" assassin. I hope they make it look more inobtrustive again.

I never said TWCB would be in charge, but we know that some amount of them coexisted with/lived on earth with humans for a long time before going extinct. I'm just saying, the further back you go in time the more likely a TWCB or a more noticeable hybrid of them and a human will crop up.

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I doubt they would have them be in charge either. Unless they're smart about it. The Isu look similar enough to humans, save for the way they dress and speak. In Ancient Egypt, that form of dress, garb or clothing, when worn by a high ruler of some sort could just be perceived as par for the course. I wouldn't be surprised if we're sent to Assassinate our last human Target in the whole game, and he's not actually Human.

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Also, Julius Caesar was crucial to the crowning of Cleopatra in Egypt and Cleopatra/Julius Caesar had a lot of overlap and visits between Egypt and Rome... and are both Templars (or at least Templar aligned) in AC Lore. So that time period could make sense as long as the trilogy idea mentioned above is true...

Hell, after Caesar's assassination, Mark Antony (a Caesar supporter) formed the Second Triumvirate with others ultimately leading to the transition of Rome from Oligarchy to Autocratic Empire. Mark Antony even died in Alexandria, from a self inflicted sword wound when he thought Cleopatra was dead. He was taken to her and died in her arms.

Sounds ripe with Templar storylines to me... "self inflicted sword wound" sounds like a Templar cover-up for "assassinated" in the same way Cleopatra died when she was bitten by an asp (which we know in AC Lore was wielded by Amunet).

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Oh, they're called the Isu? That's OK I guess.

And as for them looking similar to humans, there was an account of someone meeting one of them in in ancient Greece, in Project Legacy I think. It seems like even in non-holographic form, they have a strange aura about them and are difficult for humans to comprehend. That's the whole concept for why they were seen as Gods, right? (also they're pretty damn tall.)

@doublemcstab, that sounds interesting, but the details the leaker mentioned sound like they're trying to use less-well-documented historical events so they can create more of their own stories. Obviously there's nothing stopping them from using that, but I'd prefer in general if AC became more about things happening off to the side of well-known historical events rather than being right in the middle of it. So the feeling is more like "this could have plausibly happened during that time and gone undocumented" rather than "this is an alternate take on how this real thing actually happened"

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Right you are.

What I was trying to get at was the idea that, because this person would be a ruler or leader, anyone who asked, "Have you seen that guy? He's so tall! What about the circuitry in his skin!?" The only answer any serf or slave could give would be, "Duh, of course he's tall and he has circuits in his skin, Ted, he's a freaking PHARAOH." Given what we know of ancient Egyptian history, Pharaohs, Kings, Queens, Rulers in general were barely lesser than Gods themselves. That's how their people perceived them. I'm sure that could fit, within one context or another.

As for things not actually being right in the thick of historical events, I kind of have to agree. The more Assassin's Creed becomes content with merely retelling history and having players do one or two things alongside famous figures, the more derivative and iterative it tends to end up feeling. Some people criticized AC3 of this: "You're telling me this one man just happened to be right beside each and every single one of these famous figures while all of these events happened?" After a certain point it starts to feel, for lack of a better term, fan-fiction-y. Having events take place with proximity to the historical ones but not directly in the middle of them all would be good for gameplay and story alike.

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Yeah, AC3 leaned more heavily on that stuff in the first half than in the second half, and I definitely think the first half was slowed down mainly by that kind of stuff. If Haytham hadn't gotten entangled in an elaborate Historical Event and instead went straight to "free Zio and let her bring you to the cave" after getting to Boston, for example, it wouldn't have felt like his segment dragged.

Historical accuracy is admirable, and I don't have any problem with the trick of choosing real people who were known to have been murdered during the time the mission takes place, but the main issue is getting entangled within these very proscribed and specific events that don't necessarily account for the needs of the larger story you're trying to tell, or further it in any way.

Though of course if the larger story sucks, it doesn't matter if you're side-stepping most fixed historical points. (as Unity proved with its mostly original and completely lifeless plot)

Re: TWCB rulers, I still think it's a stretch that an actual full-blooded Isu would be able to pass for a pharaoh, since people would surely notice that none of the other pharaohs have the same effect and would thus all flock to the one or two who were Isu. Not to mention pharaohs died in presumably normal human lifespans.

But I could buy Sages or other humans with high concentrations of Isu blood having a reduced but similar effect on people, and thus being in power.

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Right, that does make sense. In addition, it'd be even more of a stretch to claim that every Pharaoh at the time happened to be Isu. It'd be interesting to see what they'll do with it, or what kind of involvement they'd have in the story.

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Jermaine Tito wrote:
Oh, they're called the Isu? That's OK I guess.

I still prefer the ominous Those Who Came Before... (duh duh duunnnn).

tl;dr version (oh man, call me Jackie Marlon): I rambled but didn't want to delete it. read if you want.

I agree that being in the thick of things at every turn wouldn't be the correct way to go.

However, I think that there's a big difference between doing so in this time period and doing so in the American revolution... an 1800 year difference. I think people would latch on a little better because of the time/distance involved. We have so many first hand accounts and a near perfect history of the colonies in the 1770s. Every single thing in the game could be contested with easily known facts. As a society (in America at least) we have romanticized so many of those events as being larger than life, that when we see one person at all of them we have no other response than to be skeptical, because so many of us KNOW what happened more perfectly than any other period of history. We don't have nearly as much information or primary sources from Ancient Egypt. We have a bunch of stone tablets and a bunch of papyrus with symbols on them that we hope we understand. We don't have family journals from someone's great grandfather that lived through it. All I'm trying to say is that it would certainly be easier to swallow than the American Revolution was. Honestly, Ezio was in the thick of things all across Italy, then in Rome with the Borgias, and was even in the middle of a power struggle in Constantinople and people accept that as plausible. And that was only 500 years ago. Just as time heals all wounds, time also distances us from the black and white facts to where we no longer have a perfect knowledge - just guesses. Really good guesses, but guesses nonetheless. People get PhD degrees after 10 years of research on these subjects for making these really good guesses, but that's all they are.

All said: I WANT to see historical figures when I play a historical action game. There's a reason that people are historical figures, and it's because they did something important. AC seems to focus (a lot) on regime changes and power-to-the-people times of history. I would be very bummed if I didn't at least interact with the people that were in power and doing the overthrowing - it just doesn't make sense. To steal an example from Shakespeare: I don't want a Rosencrantz and Guildenstern running errands for Claudius video game; I want Hamlet killing Claudius. (okay, bad example because Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are awesome).

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I don't think people really think Ezio's story was plausible, it's more that they got tired of that kind of historical integration by Ac3.

anyways I agree about there being more details to fill in, and that's basically what I was saying. I'd rather not rewrite facts we already know, like someone killing themselves out of grief. There's plenty of room to allow the history to mostly be correct, now, while our own adventures are more about themselves.

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Agreed completely.

I think going further back in time allows us more history to fill in than more recent eras. I'm glad they are doing it for the first time (for real). Every other game got closer and closer to present day (Black Flag and Rogue were extensions of 3 in my mind so don't count here) meaning they were going to run out of places to fill in details. We were going to HAVE to see a showdown in the present day because we would have run out of past.

Now that they are going back, the franchise can get back to basics. No more grand theft auto: carriage. No more gunpowder and cannon balls on giant ships. Now, if only AC could be realistic when it comes to smoke bombs... I mean, they were useful for Ezio for sure, but weren't invented until 1848!! Which means Syndicate is the only game that should even have Smoke Bombs!

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Double McStab with Cheese wrote:
Now, if only AC could be realistic when it comes to smoke bombs... I mean, they were useful for Ezio for sure, but weren't invented until 1848!! Which means Syndicate is the only game that should even have Smoke Bombs!

I'd tread real careful there, about things like this. Altair Ibn-La'Ahad invented the first human-used firearm entire centuries before the rest of humanity did, and Ezio used it even more frequently than Altair did. Provided something is written well and an earnest effort is made to justify it in-universe, it makes sense to me. The feeling of "wow, that's badass!" does not always have to be attached to inconsistency or anachronism.

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Yes. If it makes sense and is consistent in the narrative for the Assassins to have some technology before the rest of humanity, then I'm all for it. It would have made much more sense if Ezio couldn't just go to any shop and buy them though. Why were they so readily available that everyone could have them 400 years before their invention in the real world? Yes, this is a slippery slope and only one example, I know. But what else are we going to talk about for an extra year if not the feasibility and realism in the games? Innocent

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Double McStab with Cheese wrote:
Yes. If it makes sense and is consistent in the narrative for the Assassins to have some technology before the rest of humanity, then I'm all for it. It would have made much more sense if Ezio couldn't just go to any shop and buy them though. Why were they so readily available that everyone could have them 400 years before their invention in the real world?

THIS on the other hand is COMPLETELY reasonable to narrow our eyes at. I really wish the Assassin's Creed games would pay more attention to their worlds and spend more time justifying little mechanics and gameplay features like this. It can make all the difference in keeping someone wanting to suspend whatever disbelief needs to be held aloft - as opposed to having everything be so overtly game-y. It's not just us either, most of my more "casual" gaming friends who enjoy a spot of AC once in a while also criticize sloppy touches like this.

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i seem to recall that at least in revelations the bomb-crafting was based on actual historical byzantine technologies?

And also i'm pretty sure explosives were invented before firearms.

Re: buying smoke bombs at shops, I thought the conceit was that you were buying the materials to fashion more? same with rope darts and parachutes.

Anyways I'm also quite into the loss of some of the modern equipment build-up. carriage-racing I don't really have a problem with, that basic driving model seems timeless in a way, as horse-drawn things-with-wheels have been pervasive throughout most of history in some form.

But stuff like smoke bombs and grappling hooks seem like a thing to return to after the basic gameplay has been honed significantly more, so i'm glad they've got a more technologically stripped-down era to play with.

(Who wants to bet that grappling hook tech will be reused for a few modern gameplay segments?)

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I too, am excited to see them go to an era with less advanced tools, and hopefully pay more attention to their AI Manipulation. In Unity and Syndicate, there were many times that I felt my abilities were "playing the game for me." Smoke Bombs turn off Stealth pretty much entirely, because Smoking a radius allows you to run through like you own the place, and there are almost no repercussions for using them. You have so many and Coughing enemies do not Investigate or even wonder what just happened after the effect has passed. Knives didn't distract as well or consistently as I thought they would when thrown in Syndicate either. That in turn led to the abuse of Smoke Bombs and the effective invisibility granted by the Kidnap mechanic.

I can see the tech they built for grappling or shooting rope reused in some modern gameplay segment, yeah. People seem to have gotten accustomed to it, for better or worse, so.